@ maccino....i would assume that the Non LF kappa drivers would be more suitable than the kappa LF you mention, LF drivers are designed for sub woofer application, they dont work well as a full range driver due to the 2kHz bump, so the frequency range is usually crossed over to allow only the real lows into the mix. i would look at the Em 3015 neo driver, its a big cab and the neo weight savings would be good, i haven't modelled it but would recommend getting the T/S parameters and adjusting the box volume to suit

my new e-mail id is sosaudiosys@gmail.com and lovhelp@gmail.com

what do you think about use Eminence kappa 15lf for this box?Can I asked for the plans please? to this mail: maccino@seznam.czthank you so much.

playdjboyes wrote: thanks tony i will try to test all things.

Prashant, I was in no way criticizing you or your design. You have the right to design and make boxes in any way that you like.

I wish you well with your endeavours and hope that you can make a career out of something that you obviously have a passion for.

Tony

thanks tony i will try to test all things.

If I were going into production with the necessary machinery and assembly jigs then I would undoubtedly make most of my cabs trap. shaped, if only because I think they look so much better than a plain old rectangular box.

With my own boxes I try to minimise the visual aspect by making them as narrow as possible given the driver size and then using wrap around grills. The picture I posted a while ago of my double 12" jobby shows this very well.

For a given box design just net volume and port sizes are all that's required. I think that anyone serious about making loudspeakers should then have learned the necessary skills to take it from there.

Its a bit like taking up golf and then playing St. Andrews without even going for any lessons or spending time on the driving range, not to be advised

Gets of high horse.

Tony

Since reading this thread, I've been trying to remember the first time we did a trap cab. It's certainly true that a lot of, shall we say younger builders, think that this is the norm. In most cases when people put their cabs together, there is little thought for the technical side of it, and don't realize that the angles on the box sometimes have no bearing on the proper dispersion angles, that are decided by the components used. Most ASS horns that were built were much longer than they had to be. I discovered long ago that if the wave forms crossed over each other somewhere out there in front of the cab, there was no coupling effect. For me, this has always been a major consideration with dispersion angles. This means that, whether our box was square or trap., it didn't make any difference. There is a small case for an angled cab containing a mid speaker. The angles can help knock the stuffing out of direct waves coming back and forth on the speaker, although this would only apply to the waves that were shorter than the box itself. Bass is not affected by the shape of the box as the waves are far too big.
I guess the Spektra range of cabs were the first trap cabs for me, and this was done to follow a fashion.

YAS THATS TRUE
REQUIRED in New cabinet:- CALCULATING DRIVER PARAMETER & INTERNAL VOLUME LITERS(VB),(FB) also very IMP FREQUENCY TUNNIG.

The word “speaker” is the shortened form of the word “loudspeaker” and it refers to a device that converts electrical signals into sound waves that we can hear.

Why do drivers come in so many different sizes? Because it is nearly impossible to make one piston driver that can reproduce sound waves over the entire 20 Hz to 20 kHz frequency range of human hearing. To produce low frequencies a driver needs to have a large diaphragm and enough mass to resonate at a low frequency. To produce high frequencies a driver needs to have a small diaphragm with a low mass. Obviously, these requirements are in opposition so drivers are usually designed to produce only a portion of the sound. This gives rise to multi-way speaker systems like the two-way system shown above. It uses a tweeter for the high frequencies and a woofer for the low frequencies.


The job of the crossover network is to divide the audio signal. For this reason, crossover networks are sometimes called “dividing networks”. The frequency where the sound is divided is called the “crossover frequency”. Ideally, a crossover frequency is chosen which protects the tweeter, allowing it to produce only those frequencies that it can reproduce the best, and allows both the response and coverage pattern of the woofer to blend well with the tweeter. Note: The “coverage pattern” is the shape of the listening area where a driver will provide a relatively uniform direct sound pressure level.

I m a sound engg student i just learn how to create new idea & discuss with all. any suggestion plz reply me

thanks

The topic of trapezoid shaped cabinets came up on another discussion board a few years ago. Because this style of design has been so prevalent since the mid 1980s, most people under the age of 30 assumed that loudspeakers had to be that shape.

As Tony said this is not true. From a performance point of view the difference is negligible, and very very few are designed to be arrayed at the same angle as the side walls. However with a decent table saw it is not too difficult to cut the angles.

Reasons why I use a trapezoid design are:

1. I don't find them much more trouble to make.
2. The shape visually slims the cabinet.
3. I can fix the baffle size and use the taper to adjust the cabinet volume.
4. It sometimes enables a more efficient use of a sheet of ply.

If number 1 didn't apply then I wouldn't worry about 2 and 4, and I would ajust 3, the cabinet volume, by some other means.

For most loudspeaker based on the bass reflex style, plans are not really necessary. An internal volume and tuning frequency should allow anyone to produce something similar. More useful would be any cross over and eq settings. These will have far more impact on the performance of the cabinet than getting the taper angle of the cabinet walls correct.

nickyburnell wrote: Angles would be good. Very trendy all this multi angle stuff, a ton of work though.

I think that for most user's it is a total waste of time. So called reduction in standing waves etc. is IMHO a crock of shyte.
And as for better to array them er no comment.

Tony

INSIDE USE RCF MB15H401 & ND850 1.4" Hf Trasducer with HF64 flayer & 1800hz passive crossover.

Also u can use Beyma 15G40 & CP750ND with 1200Hz passive crossover

Angles would be good. Very trendy all this multi angle stuff, a ton of work though.

So. Just out of curiosity, the original woofer used in these was the sn12mb correct? Ive found that the lavoce waf123.01 has almost identical specs as the pa audio and models almost the same. Can anyone confirm these will work before i pull the trigger on 8 of them?

The B&C DE250 is a good choice: speakerprojects.wordpress.com/2017/08/29...-various-waveguides/

Here's a pic of a couple of the finished cabs. 

Does anyone have a proper comp horn recommendation when using the 12pe32's? Also neo drivers comparable to the 12pe32?

Aye I thought so. Cheers.

As a rule of thumb, wadding the rear chamber of a top is always a good idea.

No ones posted on this plan for a while so thought I would. Just built a pair of single driver versions of the SMT. Just wondering if people put any wadding in the chamber? Also, I made up a cutting list for 18mm ply. If that would be useful for anyone I can get it posted. I'll post some pictures of my build once the paints dry!

If you would cross the SMT212 somewhere between 100 and 200 Hz, the 12p80nd would have it's benefits. The 12MI100 is simply not made to be used below 200 - 250 Hz but as you say it's going to start there anyway. It's the little things like the aluminium VC and the 2nd and 3th HD, that makes me think the 12MI100 is the easiest choice here. If you ever intent to cross below 200 Hz, ever, the 12p80nd.

Best regards

Hi I am planing on building a pair of these SMT 212.
The thing is that I can´t decide between Beyma 12mi100 or 12p80nd for the midrange drivers.
Is the 12p80nd worth the extra money? How big an advantage dos the 12p80nd have over the 12mi100
- when it comes to sound quality?
- when it comes to max SPL?

Also, will 2 12p80nd working together corse less phase problems than 2 12mi100 working together?

I am planing to use the SMT´s from about 200-250 HZ and up.

:ohmy: these things are intense! Great Design

Coming along real nice like. gonna have 4 of these bad boys.

Hi All...I'm building 2 of the SMT 212 but in a single 12" driver version.

At the moment I am designing the plan to cut all the panels

I was wondering if the the 12" driver and the comp driver should be vertically aligned or if a configuration like the attached sketch is fine ( where dark blue 12" driver sits at the back part of the cabinet and the purple comp driver + horn sits a bit forward - drivers are not aligned in this case )
sketch is based on the measures of 18sound 12mb700 12" mid bass driver and Compression P Audio BM-D750 Serie 2 with Horn P Audio PH-3223
This will determine the width/position of the horn baffle.
From other build I've seen on the web it seems that they are not vertically aligned but before I cut the wood I wanted to make sure I am not making any mistake

thank you for any advice !

Nice looking

I have built 1 of these so far with a single 12 beyma sm112n a beyma 605nd(6.5") and beyma CD10Fe. I have the drivers to build 3 more although I need to get the three other 605nd's reconed. Will post build pics when I find them or take more when I build the next one

Hi there. My take on the smt212 with a panel between the 12" drivers. Loaded with 18sound 12nd710 and bms 4550

Hey guys I'm purchasing wood for 4 Smt 212's how many sheets of ply do I need?

Hello Everyone,

Does anyone know the maximum frequency response of the 12" section as a single? I was hoping to use them from 200-1.4khz

Thanks

I need soft copy design bass reflector 15" woofer... anybody help

I need plans for a single 12" cabinet.

Hi Everyone,

just wondering would this design work well with any 12" fane drivers

i.e 12mbn and 12bmn?

Many Thanks

Ollie

I have the PDN12MH25's in SMT212's and they are amazing with 2" Fane CD280's and when I used 2 of them at a marquee event last year the Police had a report from someone complaining about noise pollution nearly 7 miles away. I honestly did not believe the officer when he approached us at the end of the night? I laughed it off as a joke. He could not believe it either until he had stood in the persons garden and he could hear it for himself. I have 4 SMT's and I would highly recommend everyone to try them.

www.precision-devices.com/Product-Details/PDN12MH25 , :blush: sorry guys ihad the wrong model number of the 12" drivers originally. My bad. oops! :blush:

should i use the PD12SB30 or the PD 123ER?

any news on this? I am looking to build them as a single driver unit, however has anyone built them to take a top hat for poll mounting them?

what drivers are best?

Gareth

Can you explain the nature of the phasing problem please?

Hi guys. I am building the full size SMT212. I was wondering about the size of the panel, labeled "H". Would that be sufficient enough to block the phasing problem, between the two twelve inch mids

how much wood do i need in total?

nikkelbatenburg wrote: Hopefully the 15'' do deliver hard kick bass, thats the reason I want to build them. Yes 4 CBe's and 2 X-tro is the idea, maybe I build 2 extra CBe's!

I have just that:-) -Actually the CBes from diskosucks:-)
And I'm considering exactly the same, ehm + 2 xtros:-)

But Discosucks does not have the cnc plans for the subs anymore, anyone?

good

Help !
Where can I find the X8 Mk2 flare pls?

It's the kick section I find lacking power .

I am about to upgrade the the 15" in the h3 to the h3+'s driver ( 400 to 700 watt aes )

But im not sure will this making much of a difference in spl . The same way as i would Imagen your cbe's are just as loud as mine .

Which section of the H3's you miss power for that better mix? That are serious drivers, my are loaded with Rcf lfg401 but I think the difference in watts matters a lot for the output. Are you going to buy some more H3's or build some xtro's maybe??

I use two h3's with 4 cbe's .

My cbe's are loaded with fane colossus 18 1500 , and they are really loud . I think if i had two more h3's it would be a better mix .

And how many H3's do you use in combination with the 4 CBe's? I dont know exactly what you mean with ''but the h3's can get left behind at high spl'' ?? Do you think the Xtro's are better than H3's? I have seen a couple of times H3's for sale but I never wanted to buy them, I prefer a self made system for the idea :lol:

Sweet , i have 4 cbe's that use with martin h3's .

I like the kick / cbe combo but the h3's can get left behind at high spl so i bet the x tro's would work well .

Hopefully the 15'' do deliver hard kick bass, thats the reason I want to build them. Yes 4 CBe's and 2 X-tro is the idea, maybe I build 2 extra CBe's!

Always loved the look of x tro's .

Are the two 15''s designed too deliver hard kick ?

are you planning to use the x tro's with the cbe's in your picture?

Next summer im going to build two Xtro's. I've bought almost all the speakers and horns but not 8 inch midspeakers. My first plan was tot buy the original 8pe21 from B&C and make the original wooden horn. But I've read a lot at this kind of forums and most people say that the wooden horn don't work so well. I live in the Netherlands and it is possible to order the XT8 horn flare from the UK. But it is an expensive horn flare so I thought it would be better to make a double 8 inch section for less money. I have seen some pictures from a version with a double 8'' but I never find any exact plans of it. Someone any idea? Or the mykey horn is the answer for the most perfect Xtro build?

anyone know about how much these cabs weigh? really considering building a pair or 2 of these.

Masterpiece of Craftmanship..!!!

Does anyone have the autocad files for the X-tro ??
I've find the PDF drawings but impossible to find the Autocad parts....

If someone have this in a part of his harddisk...

Thx :mrgreen:

Nice work can you build me one of these?...im looking for this design with just one 15"

good job but need to know if i make a pair will it sustain 4 projection bass bins cos lm having trouble with recovering my mid-range after makin 4 projector bass bins with P audio sd18" speaker .lm thinking of making X-TRO but with one 15' speaker not two has any made one with one 15' speaker yet

awesome nicely done

eminence kappa pro 15 LF will probably work well, but check you can get the driver in with the doors on, as they are not slim neodymium magnets

Its says the recommeded drivers are the 18 Sound drivers. Other than the 18 Sound drivers what other drivers can be used. I am an authorized Eminence dealer here in the states and was wondering which drivers are suitable?

try mykey on this forum....... he makes an 8" horns......

Hi !Who is making fibrglass horn for 8" spekar X-tro

cabin was beautiful.I did mid horn timber.I like the original one.You can see on my site. www.lefcamusic.com

yes any thing is possible but, with one 15" horn only it would not play as low, and the mid and high frequencys may be too over powering. I.e. in doing this it would change the hole concept of this box. You may be better to design a new box based on the extro design.

for example take one of the 15" horns then re-design it using a 12" driver, with a 6.5" horn and a 1" hf horn............

nrpinc what you need to remember is the xtro sounds very good as it was designed to sound. By changing its design may indeed make it sound not as good.

I like the box the way it is. I think its a great idea. I was asking if it could be built with only 1 15" driver instead of 2 thats all. i don't want to change the 8" or 1" section, I was just wondering if it would be possible with 1 15" driver.